Spending “Toronto Money” Across Canada

Houses

6 minute read

January 21, 2022

Where in the world is Murfreesboro, Tennessee?

Well, it’s not “Mumfreesboro,” and I know that now, thanks to Google spell-checking my mistake.

A client of mine recently told me that she’s looking at retiring to Murfreesboro, Tennessee, which apparently is the hottest market in the United States.  She’s thinking that she’ll sell her large condo here in Toronto and look for a tiny pied-a-terre that she can use when she’s in the city.

Great plan, right?

But what is a pied-a-terre going to cost?  And how big (or small…) is it going to be?

Sure, there are pre-construction condos routinely being designed and built in the 270 – 290 square foot range, but that’s not what she’s looking for.

400 square feet in a not-so-new but not-old building sounds about right.

So what’s that going to cost?

I recently sent her an example of a condo that I really liked, not too far from where she currently lives.

430 square feet of well-laid-out space and listed for $468,800.

She thought that price was attractive, even at almost $1,100 per square foot.  But I told her, “That’s just the list price.  This unit will likely sell over $500,000, my target is somewhere around $525,000.”

Then something happend.  A little something called, “The 2022 spring market,” as we’ll hear a lot more about next week!

When the unit sold, it obliterated any previous record…

 

That’s almost $1,400 per square foot, and while I know that pales in comparison to some pre-construction prices out there, this is an absurd price for a unit in this building based on anything resembling a “comparable sale.”

At $590,000 for 430 square feet, what’s her move now?

Does she look for something smaller?

Does she look for something in an inferior building or an inferior location?

Or does she buy a second and third house in Murfreesboro, Tennessee?

A friend of mine recently remarked, “I swear, I should just sell my house and move to Tallahassee.  I can get a job at a bait-and-tackle shop, making minimum wage, and have a really nice, laid-back life, resting comfortably on the money I made in the Toronto market.”

Sure, I guess that’s an option.

He’s probably got $1,000,000 of equity in his house plus another half-million in two investment properties.

He could buy a really great house for $350,000 USD and even if he only averaged 4% per annum on his equity, he could live off the interest.  What a life, right?

Last week, there were twenty-seven offers on a condo on Blue Jays Way which sold for $725,000, listed at $566,000.  This was a 1-bed, 1-bath, no parking, no locker, $400/month fees which include zero utilities, and it was barely 500 square feet.

Sometimes, it’s depressing to think about real estate prices in Toronto and what we could get in other areas of the country for the same amount.

But the funny thing about a frown is that when you turn it upside down, you’ve got a smile!

So in the spirit of Fun Friday, let’s see how far our money would go in other markets, and if you guys are up for it, let’s dream a little bit.

Let’s take that $590,000 figure that the 430 square foot condo sold for last week and see what we can get in a few choice cities and towns in Canada for the same amount.  Our game is as follows: you have to vote for which option you would take if you were to move yourself and/or your family, while taking into consideration the city itself, not to mention the lifestyle and everything down to the weather!

Sound good?

Ten options is too many but five might not be enough.  Seven is my favourite number, so here we go…

 


 

Option #1: Winnipeg

Detached
4-Bed
3-Bath
Built in 2004
1,788 square feet

I suppose it doesn’t help that every house in Winnipeg is photographed with a mound of snow out front, but how can you compare living in a 430 square foot condo in Toronto with living in a 4-bedroom house in Winnipeg, right?

Maybe you don’t want to be a Jets fan.

Maybe you don’t love the idea of temperatures around -10 being “mild” outside.

But for the purposes of our “game,” let’s ignore the job you’d take in Winnipeg or the distance from your wife’s family.  Let’s just look at the value of this house versus the Toronto condo and every other property on our list…

Option #2: Calgary

Detached
4-Bed
4-Bath
Built in 1981
2,500 square feet

This isn’t a new house by any stretch but 1981, compared to some of the vintage in Toronto, is new(er).

Renovated inside, this place is huge.  2,500 square feet above grade plus basement.  4-beds, 4-baths, and a 48-foot frontage!

You could fit that 430 square foot Toronto condo in the front half of the main floor of this house!

Option #3: Quebec City

Detached
3-Bed

2-Bath
Built in 2014
2,100 square feet

How about a 98-foot frontage, folks?  How much would that cost in Toronto?

You don’t speak French?  Aucun probleme!  That’s nothing a few audio-cassettes in the car can’t cure.  Or, I suppose, a podcast for those tech-savvy young’ins…

Hey, I thought that “climatiseur mural” referred to some sort of mountain painting on the wall, but guess what – it’s an air conditioner!  Amazing!

Why rot away in a 430 square foot shoebox in Toronto when you can get a stone mansion for the same price?

Option #4: Prince Edward Island

Detached
5-Bedroom
3-Bathroom
Built in 1985
2,000 square feet

Ah yes, Prince Edward Island!  Where you can stand on the roof of your house and see the whole province!

How about acreage, folks?

Twenty minutes from Charlotteown, “New Glasgow Hills” is the perfect place to come home to every night after a relaxing day working at Home Depot without a care in the world, after selling your Toronto home, quitting your job as an accountant, and spending your days helping people find gardening supplies.

Oh, and there’s no reason for kids not to want to play outside when this is your backyard:

Welcome home!

I don’t know about you, but I’m just about ready to buy this place…

Option #5: Moncton

Detached
3-Bed
4-Bath
Built in 2009
2,200 square feet

Seriously, what’s not to like?  I mean, other than all the snow, but we live in Canada so let’s just get used to seeing all these feature photos on MLS having snow-covered driveways.  That, and the “Realtor” watermark in the photos too.  That’s a non-Toronto thing…

This house last sold for $360,000 in 2016 so it’s not like the Moncton market isn’t appreciating with the rest of the country, but the driveway alone on this property is larger than the lot size for a house on Norway Avenue in Toronto’s Beaches that sold for $1,370,000 last week.

The finished basement adds another 500 square feet, by the way.  Just in case this house, the size of over six of those 430 square foot condos in Toronto, isn’t enough space…

Option #6: Moose Jaw

Detached
5-Bed
3-Bath
Built in 1981
3,800 square feet

No, that’s not a typo.  This is a 3,800 square foot house listed for $559,900.

Oh, I should also mention that the lot is 70 x 312 feet.

Are we moving out of our Toronto bachelor-condo yet?

Work the price down from $559,900, and we might have room to buy an SUV to put in that driveway, all for the price of that 430 square foot Toronto condo.

Haven’t you always wanted to say that you live in “Moose Jaw?”  Is there anything more Canadian?

Option #7: Prince George

Detached
4-Bed
3-Bath
Built in 2006
2,400 square feet

No, it’s not Vancouver.  It’s Prince George.  But aren’t we leaving Toronto to get away from massive cities that you may as well nickname, “Buffalo North?”

Prince George, which was named with two-hundred years of foresight on behalf of William & Kate’s first child, is a city of 74,000 people that has five ski hills within a two-hour drive and which supplies jobs mainly in the forest products, energy, minerals, and metals sectors.

It’s the largest city in Northern B.C. and features more than one-hundred green spaces via an extensive system of trails and connected parks.

I’ve never been, and I don’t know anybody within arm’s length (or current shouting distance…) who has, but if you can get a 4-bedroom, 2,400 square foot house in the $500K range, then what the heck are people doing here in Toronto, right?

So, what say ye?

Tell me you’re the person who’s selling his or her house and investment property and moving to one of these cities and buying one of these houses, then tell me which one.

Tell me you’re the person who’s looking at a 430 square foot condo in Toronto for $590,000, and your employer gives you the option of moving to one of these cities and buying one of these houses, then tell me which one.

Tell me to have a great weekend, and I’ll tell you the same!

Written By David Fleming

David Fleming is the author of Toronto Realty Blog, founded in 2007. He combined his passion for writing and real estate to create a space for honest information and two-way communication in a complex and dynamic market. David is a licensed Broker and the Broker of Record for Bosley – Toronto Realty Group

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27 Comments

  1. Jenn

    at 8:21 am

    Very fun!

    I’m ranking mine in order:

    1. Calgary
    2. Prince George
    3. Prince Edward Island
    4. Moncton
    5. Moose Jaw
    6. Winnipeg: too cold
    7. Quebec City: I don’t speak French!

    1. Jon

      at 11:22 am

      Nobody moves TO Winnipeg.

      People move FROM Winnipeg.

    2. Sirgruper

      at 1:19 pm

      Totally agree save I’d swap Quebec City for Winnipeg for the food.

      1. Murasaki

        at 8:35 pm

        Quebec City would actually move much further up on my list, maybe all the way to #1. For one thing, you don’t really have to speak (much) French to get by in QC, plus most importantly you’re reasonably close to Montreal, the only North American city I’d live in besides good ol’ TO.

  2. London Agent

    at 9:45 am

    Quebec City for me, although that Moose Jaw home is pretty attractive at the price. This did turn out to be a fun geography lesson because I could have sworn that Moose Jaw was somewhere in B.C. Alas, I don’t think I could move to Saskatchewan if they gave me the house for free.

  3. Joel

    at 12:38 pm

    I really like that house in Moose Jaw, but if I was actually moving it would be Calgary as I like the city.

  4. Perpetually Agitated

    at 2:07 pm

    Am heading to Moose Jaw:) This market gives me hives…

  5. Daniel

    at 2:31 pm

    David, how did you decide on these seven cities? It would seem like a very random geographic tour of the country.

    1. David Fleming

      at 11:44 am

      @ Daniel

      It was a combination of complete randomness and what’s available in other cities.

      I looked in Whitehorse and Yellowknife but there’s almost nothing for sale!

      Then in a place like Ottawa, if we’re looking at 2-bedroom condos for $590,000, then it takes the fun out of our game.

      I primarily looked at places where you could get a detached house for $590,000.

      I am tied to Toronto forever because of my occupation, but if I was retiring, my list would be:

      1) Prince Edward Island
      2) Calgary
      3) Moncton
      4) Quebec City
      5) Prince George
      6) Winnipeg
      7) Moose Jaw

      Then again, if I had to move today with my family and start up a real estate career:

      1) Calgary
      2) Winnipeg
      3) Prince George
      4) Moncton
      5) Prince Edward Island
      6) Moose Jaw
      7) Quebec City

      1. Alexander

        at 6:36 pm

        Could you please give us an update how much they sold for at the end and how fast?

  6. Frances

    at 4:58 pm

    PEI has to be number one.
    Our ultimate goal is to sell up and retire back in my home country of Ireland. My sister is house hunting right now in rural Ireland and a budget of €180,000 can get you a cottage and a substantial piece of land. But for right now at least, I’d rather be in Toronto. Not ready to move to the middle of nowhere yet.

  7. Alexander

    at 8:43 pm

    I am closing in 10 days and started looking to buy property somewhere north of the city in November. The way it looks I better keep the money as this can not go on forever. Detached houses are increasing in price by 30-50K a week. I do not know what out leaders are smoking, but Governor Tiff Macklem needs to stop doing it , wake up and do what he has to do with rate increases, otherwise this country will become the country of house flippers.
    Calgary – visited AB last summer and they have damn good beer over there and very nice beef briskets. Rockies are not too far away. PEI is also tempting and house in Quebec for sure as well.

    1. Alexander

      at 8:54 pm

      I was looking at Barcelona today, in fact. My friend who lives there mentioned newly built condos of 80 sq m for 440K euro as crazy high and sent me a link for 3 brm condo/apartment for 169K euro. Very tempting, may be I also need to get pied-a-terre…

      1. Sirgruper

        at 12:10 am

        Mmmmmm. Pincho and tapas.

      2. Kyle

        at 4:07 pm

        If you spend 500k eur you can also get a euro zone passport, under their golden passport program.

  8. Patty

    at 11:14 am

    We sold in TO five years ago and moved to Kelowna, BC. Your money won’t go as far here as the 7 options but certainly better then Toronto or Vancouver and lifestyle in the Okanagan is amazing.

  9. cyber

    at 11:28 pm

    1. Calgary – an actual city (albeit a far cry from Toronto…)
    2. Quebec City – also an actual city; would be rated higher than Calgary due to better food/culture, but Quebecoise attitude towards English speakers is a bit too much anywhere east of Montreal

    PEI one perhaps as a ‘summer property’ after retirement.

    Rest look like crappy suburban options, with bigger homes but massive lifestyle downgrades otherwise.

  10. Appraiser

    at 9:04 am

    Its easier to go down than it is to go up.

    If you live in T.O. or Van you have an abundance of choices (with money left over).

    The rest of the country not so much.

    And if you either want or need to move to either great city from elsewhere in this wonderland land of Canada, you better be holding the folding.

  11. LS

    at 9:47 am

    Having lived in Moose Jaw for twenty five years before returning to my hometown of Toronto I have seen most estate beneficiaries take their inheritances from Sask and use them to buy/renovate homes in Toronto. The prairies have seen generations of people transfer themselves and the proceeds of Sask-generated assets to TO. Not surprising that the tide has turned, if for just a little while. Guess we will see if this becomes a long-term trend.
    500k + for a stuffy little shoebox in the sky is just nuts.

  12. Tommy Twootle

    at 11:44 am

    In many cases that ship has already sailed. You better check whether there is actually anything for sale in the places you think are “easy markets” because they may have already been swamped with Toronto Money. In some places that used to be accessible there is now close to zero inventory. You might find you are in the same old bidding wars that you bring with you. You may get there and find there is nowhere at all for you to live.

  13. Jeremy

    at 11:55 am

    For a lot of people it would definitely make financial sense for people to move out of the GTA, but realistically most of those moves probably involve a significant lifestyle change moving to a much smaller city. For some people that’s great, for other’s it may not be worth it just to get a bigger house.

    What kind of car are you buying since you probably need one for most of those places?
    How far are you from downtown? (Are you actually buying in those cities or whatever their equivalent is to Mississauga or Ajax?)
    How often will you need to fly home to see your GTA based friends and family? (Although that may work the other way for people moving “back home”.)
    What are the job markets like? Friends from Toronto moved to Winnipeg a few years ago rather than the Maritimes largely because they felt there were better job prospects at the time. Maybe that’s changed with WFH post COVID, but if you aren’t ready to retire that’s a consideration. It will also obviously vary on what kind of job you are looking for.
    What is the restaurant / entertainment situation like? (Do you care?)
    How is the house heated?

    I think moving out of Toronto makes sense for a lot of people but I think for most it’s more complicated than just bigger houses for the same money.

  14. Island Home Owner

    at 9:16 am

    SO MANY better options on PEI in the $500-600K price point. You can practically buy *every single* non-luxury property west of that one for < $600K!!!

    1. David Fleming

      at 9:20 am

      @ Island Home Owner

      I should have got your input! I was somewhere between finding the nicest house, the biggest house, and the one with the best exterior photo!

      1. Island Home Owner

        at 6:33 pm

        Happy to come back with some great addresses for great Island active listings below that price point in the better Western half.

        The best option in my hometown under that price point – 27 Gavin Court, Summerside

        A nice choice in the next town West – 42 Kelly Drive, Miscouche

        A couple of nice choices in the country – 5081 Route 12, Bayside or 1865 Nodd Road, Kinkora

        And the best cottage property around that price point IMHO – 78 Gibson Lane, Chelton, PE

        1. Alexander

          at 8:29 pm

          I just noticed that those PEI houses are heated by hydro. Is it normal there and how big is the hydro bill in winter?

          1. Island Home Owner

            at 4:41 pm

            Certainly not all Island houses are heated by hydro, but lots are (as the provincial government has been incentivizing folks to switch from oil to electric heat for years to reduce carbon emissions).

            I couldn’t tell you what it costs compared to oil though as my little old house is still oil-heated (I would say it costs about $1500/winter to heat our 1300ish sq ft house here on the Island).

            Not sure anyone is natural gas heated as there’s really no infrastructure to distribute it here.

  15. Abdull rehman

    at 2:04 pm

    Aslam o alikum

Pick5 is a weekly series comparing and analyzing five residential properties based on price, style, location, and neighbourhood.

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